Betsy Paret, the circuit executive of the US Court of Appeals for the D.C. Circuit, will soon trade managing judges for farm animals, when she retires at the end of this month following nearly two decades at the court.

Paret has served as circuit executive since 2007, where she’s overseen the court known for its high-profile docket and as a feeder of judges to the US Supreme Court. During her tenure, she oversaw implementation of live-streaming, the Covid-19 pandemic, the flood of Jan. 6 cases, and Donald Trump’s in-person appearance at the federal courthouse.

And for the past nine years, she’s commuted from her home in Vermont, where she and her wife have, as she put it, “12 goats and four alpacas and 14 chickens and three dogs.”

Paret, whose official last day is Dec. 29, sat down with Bloomberg Law to discuss her tenure and what’s next for the court. This conversation has been edited for clarity and length.

Before you came to the D.C. Circuit, I understand you were at the Eastern District of Virginia.

I was hired for that in 2001. That was May. One of the first big things I had to deal with was the impact of 9/11 in the Eastern District of Virginia, and we got [the trial of Zacarias] Moussaoui. It was a huge high profile case.

Judge [Leonie] Brinkema was assigned to that case, and we had to build a high tech courtroom for her. We actually had to broadcast to five different locations throughout the country.

We had to get a website, and we had to have a special page for the case. I ended up hiring a full time public information officer, just to manage because the media, the seating, and the overflow—there was just so much.

What would you say has been the most memorable case or event generally that you’ve had at the court in your tenure?

This goes back to the 90s. There were Italian mafia defendants in a case. They were so dangerous that they were arrested in the United States, and there were so many concerns about extraditing them for trial in Italy, that they actually had the Italian judges or justices come here to our courthouse.

The whole thing was conducted in Italian. And because of just how the Italian Mafia was involved, every morning, there’d be these bomb sniffing dogs that would come through the whole facility. It was just this amazing situation, just to be a part of seeing that happen.

In terms of the circuit, it was unusual, last year, to have a former president appear in-person at an oral argument. That was just unusual and amazing and historic.

How has the court or your role changed from when you took over in the mid-2000s to now?

We talk a lot more about judges’ security. Ten years ago, we never even knew what doxxing was. We never knew what swatting was. We didn’t know the impact of online misbehavior, the importance of protecting your personal identifying information. I never thought of the job as one where my personal safety and security, or that anything affecting my job could seep into my personal life, and that’s changed.

Technology is a big issue for the judiciary. What’s next? Could we see video streaming?

Live streaming audio has been amazing for our circuit. We can run statistics, and it can be 20,000 people listening.

It’s astounding the reach and the interest.

I don’t see video coming to our circuit anytime soon. We’re not the Ninth Circuit.

But you know, who knows? Maybe one day.

What will you miss the most and miss the least after you’ve retired?

I know people say, I’m going to miss the people the most, and I guess I’ll be one of those people. I’m always amazed at just how smart our judges are.

I won’t miss hearing about the cafeteria and parking.

You’ve been going back and forth between Vermont and DC for nine years. How have you managed to keep a foot in both places?

I would often be on the 5am flight Monday mornings out of Burlington, and there was this whole group of people, and we were all doing the same thing.

There was a kind of a camaraderie.

By the time I would land in D.C., I’d have my D.C. game face on, and it was basically the hunker down, get on Metro, make the walk to the courthouse. Just put Vermont out of my mind.

And then the flight home, as soon as I landed, I’m outside of the parking garage, and just, ah, the nice, clean air, and driving home, all of the tensions of the week would just melt off me.

Are there any similarities in the skill sets at all between management of a court and management of a farm?

There is definitely a level of persuasion trying to get animals to do things that they don’t necessarily want to do, or go in directions that they don’t maybe want to go.

It’s not the same in terms of explaining why they need to follow, in words, but behaving in a way that makes them want to follow you. I think that’s similar in trying to get judges to go along with certain initiatives.

Who’s more easily persuaded, the animals or the judges?

Probably the judges. And the good thing about the judges, in my 33 years, none of them have ever spit on me, and alpacas have. So that’s a point for the judges.

What’s next for you in retirement?

I’m still relatively young. I’m only 59. One of the things that I want to do is take a class in the craft of dry stacking stone walls.

We’re putting together a YouTube page.

And finally, I’ve been working on some children’s books based on the farm animals.